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Comment by luckystarr | Hacker News Reader

I think this is nuts. First you need tips to survive if you work in restaurants because the owners pay too little, then the owners take the tips and distribute them around. What's the next level? Make tipping mandatory? May as well put it in the price.

Just ban tipping and pay the employees a fair wage. Will be better and less stressful for all parties. Customers, employees and owners.

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This is not as easy as you think.

I have met some wait staff that has gone to school for hospitality and while they make shit pay, I have had friends easily making about $2000 a week and they don't want to go to a wage system.

I have never waited, but I get the point, if you do good you can make good cash. It's the same with comission jobs.

Where tips suck is if you are at a dead place, cheap place, or you are a lazy shitty waiter.

Good service gets good tips. If you are on your phone making TikToks when you're supposed to be taking an order, and you smell like an ashtray every time you come to the table, that is why you have shit tips, and it's the same reason no one would hire you at some sort of normal wage.

Some people believe they are not paid for their worth, but it's actually heartbreaking to think how many people will flat out say NO to a job that's an actual career.

It's like when Uber drivers get upset that they don't get full benefits but lose their shit when you mention spending 5 hours a week driving around isn't really a job.

> Good service gets good tips.

This makes intuitive sense but empirically is simply not true. Tipping is far more correlated with sex and race discrimination than individual performance.

I don't understand what one has to do with the other. The owners should not rely on workers being able to receive tips in the first place. Tipping is not something involving the owner, as this is (except when contractually clarified) a direct transaction between customer and waiting staff.

To put it in a different context: I think I should pay the car rental shop less, because I know they have lots of money.

They would laugh at me.

So should the waiting staff.

> if you do good you can make good cash

Let me fix that for you: "if you look good (young/sexy etc) you can make good cash"

I've tipped beautiful women like I have tipped old men. If you can do your job then you get a tip.

Seems like people do a lot of projecting.

It's crazy to think all patrons are pervert men and all wait staff are sexy naive little girls.

It's ok to just admit you have never been to a restaurant, it's easier than sounding like some sort of Jack ass.

I'm a below average looking male and I worked in the restaurant industry before tech, both in the kitchen and front of house (serving, tending bar, management). When I served, I'd walk away from an average evening with a few hundred dollars in cash. I'm sure it's easier if you're attractive and flirty, but it's also possible to make good money by being professional.

People who have never had a job before don't want to believe you.

If you eliminate tipping and pay the employees a fair wage then you will need to raise your prices in order to do so. Which means you are wrapping what was the tip into the menu price and in essence making tipping mandatory.

That was the point, yes. On top of that it would be fairer, because everybody will pay their share of the employees' wage. Freeloading cheap food, made possible by other people's tips would no longer be possible.

Visit employee-owned restaurants more often. In San Francisco, there's Zazie and Arizmendi Bakery, they don't take tips.

> What's the next level? Make tipping mandatory? May as well put it in the price.

It’s called “automatic gratuity” and it definitely exists.

That’s not the suggestion though as that is still hiding the charge and not folding it into the price on the menus. If “automatic gratuity” is 20% just put prices up by 20%!

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