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Comment by varunsrin | Hacker News Reader

Microsoft does not launch unfinished Xboxes (hardware + software product). Apple does not launch unfinished iPads (hardware + software product)

Microsoft launches unfinished Windows builds (software). Apple launches unfinished Lion builds (software).

The question is flawed in that it assumes that they companies have different release methodologies for the same class of products. Both Microsoft & Apple are making similar choices for similar classes of products.

What Gruber is doing is comparing release methodologies of different classes of products that are in the same market space. What drives the choice of release method is not the market space, but the nature of the product being released.

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What Gruber is arguing about, and I would tend to agree is that Microsoft has "released" Windows 8 on top of a tablet that is nothing like what a tablet would ultimately be. It contains a full Core i5, with fan to keep it cool and all.

Would it have been better to wait till manufacturers were ready with their ARM based tablets that run Windows 8 rather than something PC like that runs Windows 8? Especially since based on the current demo device we will have no idea what Windows 8 will be like on actual low power hardware...

It's a developer unit! Compare it if you like to the Mac Pro Apple released to get developers started on OS X86 - they used CPUs in that were never used in the actual released version of Mac Pro.

Its job is to let developers use the functionality of the OS, and develop/debug right on the device. It's not there to run coolest or use specific SOC. For Metro Apps it won't matter what SOC you are running underneath. And I am sure ARM brethren of Samsung tablets will come out sooner or later for porting Win32 apps.

Microsoft/Nintendo/Sony absolutely "launch" unfinished consoles. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wii_U

The more 3rd party applications you need on your platform, the longer a lead time you need to give to those 3rd parties. And for that matter -- Apple does launch unfinished iOS builds/features.

Actually Microsoft hardware has previewed unfinished hardware which didn't debut at all, or was radically changed:

Microsoft Spot

Digital Home

Courier Tablet

And don't get me started on their abandon-ware hardware projects (Networking, WebTV, Digital Photo TV, Zune, Microsoft at Work, MS Automotive, etc)

This argument thread is rapidly diverging from the original issue. You are now talking about product announcements, not releases. Windows 8 was 'released' today, not announced like the Courier was.

Your current argument now is about a different problem (one that Longhorn / Vista faced), which is about announcing features before they were actually implemented and ready for release.

I'm not going to continue this, I believe my point has been made.

Don't forget about the Microsoft Cordless Phone (http://web.archive.org/web/20000301023950/http://www.microso...) or, of course, Kin.

> Microsoft does not launch unfinished Xboxes (hardware + software product).

Tell that to the millions of Xbox 360 owners whose consoles died with the red ring of death.

.. and all the iPhone users and the slew of hardware problems they faced.

I'm sorry, where do you get that? I never had a problem with iPhones, nor know anyone who ever did, except for a cracked screen or another. No antenna-gate here either. C'mon...

On the other hand, I have a 3RL'd XBox which was promptly replaced with a newer one, since it's still an amazing product and have some friends who had the same problem.

Care to list? I mean real problems, not media going mad over non-issue (like antennagate). More people were annoyed by miscalibrated proximity sensor but that was fixed in software.

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