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Comment by ranting-moth | Hacker News Reader

They might not replace them, but it fulfills a role that Google could do previously.

Try to find out what type of a spring is in a spring clamp using google? "What type of a spring is in a spring clamp?" Or use whatever query you want. The top 10 results won't tell me the answer.

Ask ChatGPT. It'll tell you (spoiler: it's a tension spring or a torsion spring. It's not a coil spring.)

8 out of 10 Google results are trying to sell me spring clamps. Seriously Google, do you not see that your search engine is FUBAR?

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Hmmm, ChatGPT doesn't seem consistent:

Q: what type of spring is in a spring clamp?

A: Spring clamps are typically made with a type of spring called a helical spring or a coil spring. These springs are made of wire that is wound in a spiral shape and are used to store energy and apply a force when they are compressed or stretched. In a spring clamp, the helical spring is used to provide the clamping force that holds the clamp's jaws together. When the jaws of the clamp are opened, the spring is stretched, and when the jaws are closed, the spring is compressed, creating the clamping force. Spring clamps are commonly used in woodworking, metalworking, and other applications where a temporary hold is needed.

And even after reading through first post and your post I had to do a double take to figure out it was wrong.

This is exactly why I don't bother with copilot - I tend to skim when something looks right.

Same thing when I'm reviewing code - I don't go into details - I just do high level sanity checks, if I'm familiar with domain I check for problems I anticipate, look for potential improvements where my experience matters.

If I have to go in depth I might as well do the thing on my own.

Google says "tempered spring" in bold. Doesn't sound like the answer you're looking for, but it was very clear.

The majority of the search results are for places to buy a spring clamp. This is because the overwhelming majority of people who search for that term are looking to buy them, not to learn about what they are. I assume this is true for most specialized parts and equipment.

The majority of humans are more interested in accomplishing a task than they are in any form of learning. So that's what Google optimizes for. They have billions of users and most of them aren't looking to learn about how anything works on a given day. They just need to buy a clamp, or whatever.

> Ask ChatGPT. It'll tell you

Without any way for you to know if it's the right answer or not. Wow, so useful.

How is this any different than Google? The only thing Google exceeds at is serving you SEO garbage on every query.

Google results(plural!) give you alternatives and references, i.e. you know where each answer is coming from and SEO spam is easily identifiable.

ChatGPT just gives you an answer that's confidentially wrong sometimes.

But isn't that just a UI problem at heart? It would be easy to ask for references for its conclusion.

ChatGPT doesn't have references and doesn't make conclusions, it's a statistical model.

Ask it for references, it will invent you URLs that look legit but don't exist.

Well, I then did a google image search (which is much better than it's traditional search) and it came up with things that did look like that one I had in my hand.

But I do get where you're coming from, ChatGPT is way too confident when it's wrong!

thats one good thing about search you get multiple results and different opinions

I bet google could deliver the answer but they need to serve ads.

Same would happen with ChatGPT. As soon they need to make money without charging the users directly, its answers will change.

Curious, the second result for me was aboutmechanics.com, which said it was a coil clamp. But I agree Google seems to be interpreting the question as "what's a spring clamp".

Interesting. aboutmechanics.com is not in my top 10 results. But even aboutmechanics is wrong, it's not coil spring. It's torsion spring.

My understanding is spring clamps typically use a helical spring, which is a compression spring coiled into a cylindrical shape. Other types of springs, such as leaf springs and torsion springs, may also be used in some spring clamps, depending on the specific design and intended use of the clamp.

In your first post you also equated tension and torsion springs, but they’re very different from each other. The former stores and releases linear energy while the latter stores and releases rotational energy.

Either way, I don't know that I see it an example of ChatGPT "replacing" a search-engine: search engines never really claimed to be able to provide precise answers to detailed technical queries, they just do the best they can to find webpages that might contain information relating to your query. But I suspect it won't be long at all before Google/Bing et al will be able to give you answers to such questions at least as good as ChatGPT where up-to-date/live info isn't involved. At some point they'll stop calling themselves "Search engines" and just be a single entry point for any query you might have, regardless of where the information comes from.

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