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Comment by mytailorisrich | Hacker News Reader

What's the impact of not disputing chargebacks?

If I'm going to be charged 20 euros whether I succeed or not then for small disputes I may not bother spending the time to submit evidence anymore...

Edit: I see that they have a Chargeback Protection product with costs 0.4% per transaction in which case they "cover the disputed amount and waive any dispute fees without needing to submit any evidence" (another comment by smca)... So cynically that sounds like a commercial tactic to sell that product!

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The fee gets taken regardless. Also, too many disputes (guessing overturned disputes are calculated differently than uphold ones) can lead to further fines:

> If the dispute activity for your business exceeds the thresholds set by the networks for a prolonged period of time (usually multiple months), you might be subject to fines.

https://stripe.com/docs/disputes/measuring

> The fee gets taken regardless.

Yes, that's my point.

>The fee gets taken regardless.

The fee gets paid back in full to you by Stripe if you win the dispute.

Not anymore (in Europe at least) from the article.

In the communiqué from Stripe, they state that any such fee will be repaid if you win the dispute.

https://support.stripe.com/questions/pricing-updates-for-bus...

From the very page you linked:

> Dispute fees (also known as chargebacks) will increase from €15 to €20. Due to costs for managing dispute evidence submissions, we'll no longer refund this fee if the customer's bank resolves the dispute in your favor.

It used to be that you got the fee refunded if it got resolved in your favor, but after the changes go into effect (10 April 2023), it won't be like that anymore.

Wow! In the language version they're showing me, they write the opposite. Translated from the page:

"Changes for disputes Fees for disputes (also known as chargeback or recrediting) will increase from €15 to €20. If the customer's bank resolves the dispute in your favour, the full fee will be refunded."

Edit: After doing some more research, it seems that it is only US customers that will lose their dispute fee. If you choose English (United Kingdom) as your language, it says you can keep the fee if you win the dispute.

In English (UK) it still says "* we'll no longer refund this fee if the customer's bank resolves the dispute in your favor.*" (so much for British English spelling, by the way)

But you're right that at least ub Spanish (Spain), French (France), Italian, Portuguese (Brazil) it says that the fee will be refunded if the dispute is resolved in your favour.

Oops.

I'm a Stripe customer and logged in when viewing the page, it could depend on such factors. In UK English it still says I get the fee back.

It will be interesting to see exactly who is going to have this change imposed on them.

Hellooooo - they change it in April. Thats what we talk about.

If you exceed dispute thresholds dictated by card networks, they can place you in a "dispute monitoring program".

The fines imposed can be very high if you don't take steps to mitigate disputes. We have a vested interest in ensuring businesses on Stripe aren't affected by these programs. https://stripe.com/docs/disputes/monitoring-programs

Does the dispute threshold includes all disputes or only successful ones (i.e. the ones the seller failed to overturn)?

All disputes. The purpose of the card networks' monitoring programs is to encourage businesses to prevent disputes from occurring in the first place. Some more on this here: https://stripe.com/docs/disputes/monitoring-programs/faqs

OK, thanks. So my initial point stands, then, since there is no impact apart from losing every time.

Your initial point seems sensible to me. We set a policy years ago that we ignore chargebacks other than accounting for them correctly. We have a very low rate of disputes and in our experience it sucks up a silly amount of time to deal with the few we do get (far more than recovering a typical B2C transaction in our industry is worth). There is no guarantee that you'll succeed and get any money back at all even if the dispute is blatant abuse and entirely without merit. And since now you're going to get hit with the fee in any case and you're going to get the black mark with the card networks in any case it doesn't make any sense for us to spend time and effort dealing with them. We just have to take the occasional hit as a cost of doing business that obviously shouldn't exist but does because cards.

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