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Comment by nixpulvis | Hacker News Reader

But just like at state parks, tread lightly.

I've gotten in trouble before while exploring and then being accused of putting my nose where it shouldn't be. It can look like you're wasting your time looking for distractions, or trying to dig up dirt. Not everyone in all parts of your company is going to like you poking around. You also risk picking up new responsibilities if people catch wind that you might be offering help. This can be the start to a promotion and also a good way to just make your days longer for no additional compensation. Not all managers will respond to the leverage of cross department work you took on yourself, though they probably should.

That said, if you do it well, which is an art of it's own. I agree, the potential benefits outweigh the risks.

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Agree 100% with this - I think in general people really like to talk about what they do, so if you come to them with an attitude of curiosity, they'll teach you a ton. I've had maybe a dozen people over my career ask me about what a PM does/how to become one, and I'm always happy to chat about it. In a few cases, I was able to get that person some involvement with the PM team (as an example, a couple were in customer support and became the support/PM liaison, who would present all the data on trends in customer issues to us biweekly).

But you do have those empire-building types who see everyone as trying to encroach on their turf. If you run into too many of those, I'd honestly suggesting looking for a new job - companies where a lot of people have that kind of attitude tend to be both not great to work at and also less than successful in the long run.

My friend got fired from his job for sticking his nose in other departments. Which is very strange because his boss told him to look at transferring into another department because he would have to transfer in the next six months or get fired. And the department he stuck his nose into offered him a lateral job. But because he failed to keep the bosses of each department apprised of where he was in the process, he trod on some toes and got fired before the lateral position could become official and it had to be an internal hire. Total mess.

the superficial way it played out isn't necessarily the reason, could have been on the chopping block already, and then whoever wanted him there found their excuse

Sounds like a toxic workplace to me.

Unsurprising, as the standard workplace is toxic, otherwise WFH would not be so popular.

I doubt WFH is so popular solely because all workplaces are toxic. A toxic workplace is one like that at American Radium in first half of 20th century, or the building of transcontinental railroad, or Hoover Dam, or Mt Rushmore.

If I had to compare the standard modern workplace (I've been at a few) with the building of the railroads, of course I’d prefer the standard. Sitting n AC pressing keys is better than being crushed by stones or heavy metal bars, all in scorching heat.

> My friend got fired from his job for sticking his nose in other departments.

This is way too little information to be meaningful.

Was he walking around talking to people in different departments about what they need, was he stealing paper from people's desks at night time when wandering around the building. Who knows.

I mean, I had hoped the context made it apparent by explaining that he messed up the politics. He actively talked with people in other departments about what they needed during the work day, tried to help them and later inquired about lateral transfers into their departments.

I had a teacher who was a ranger in yellowstone park. He would illustrate the danger of straying off the trail with this anecdote: Rangers are not allowed to wear polyester socks (or any socks made with synthetic fibers) because the geothermal activity in the park can change unexpectedly and yesterdays safe meadow could hide an unexpected layer of boiling mud without warning.

Unless you are one of the few people experienced with back-country trekking in active geothermal areas, stick to the roads and trails.

If you are unfortunate enough to be stranded in yellowstone, follow fresh game trails. They will be less likely to lead through boiling mud. On the other hand, the wildlife is unpredictable due to the massive population of stupid tourists.

Yellowstone is dangerous. Stay on the trails and roads unless you know what you are doing. And you probably don't know what you are doing.

I think this far more likely is influenced by your demeanor going into it. If you come off as arrogant or condescending people will rightfully be skeptical of your intentions. They'll assume you're trying to micro manage them and obviously you'll get pushback.

On the other hand if you come off as genuinely interested in what other people are doing with no ulterior motives, 95% of the time you'll get warm feedback. I think you'd be hard pressed to find someone that'd react confrontationally to a middle schooler asking about their job. Why? Because their intentions are innocent.

Asking "how can I be helpful?" is a huge unlock: almost everyone has too much to do and not enough time, and thus almost everyone will welcome help from someone else. (And if the way you're "poking your nose in other departments" is perceived as value-destructive instead of helpful, that is probably the root cause.)

Gotta say I've heard "how can I be helpful" once too often from people trying to poke their clueless noses in my business. Just asking about what I'm working on is totally fine though

Or more accurately ... I've heard "how can I be helpful" too often from one particular person who is invariably the opposite of helpful, and now if anyone else says it I'm instantly suspicious

Or heard it as a criticism -- the underlying implication that one is struggling.

Just an observation: decades ago in industrial companies of some size it was the practice to move newly hired managers around systematically for (say) the first 5 years so they could see how the whole company worked.

That only makes sense when people expect employees to stick around though, in today's market you would expect the vast majority of people to not finish the 5 year program yet alone show any benefits from it.

Sadly you are probably correct.

Perhaps that is the problem (at least with some sectors: a close friend's partner's daughter has worked as a civil engineer with a couple of employers for a couple or three decades now - she can show you the roads she planned and managed the building of)?

Exactly. Be humble and eager to learn, but recognise others may be suspicious of your motives anyway.

Also, don’t be that engineer that tells all the other departments what they’re doing wrong, having done a couple of Udemy courses.

Also don't be afraid to play dumb if it's something you partially understand. Helpful people will teach you more and suspicious people will more often feed you BS.

I used to attempt this often as well. Had a few minor wins, but typically I was met with polite indifference, told it was their department. Which is fortunately better than active sabotage.

One group was even bewildered I was able to integrate a department client app with their ticket database. Reduced necessary clicks by 95% or so. They didn't think it was possible. Yes, this is the caliber of folks working at a big corporation.

This is a good counterpoint (while not necessarily discouraging cross pollination). I ask parallel teams that I work with how best I can help them, which leads me into learning a lot about the different facets of the business. My experience with approaching this with curiosity and empathy will yield a more welcoming environment to learn more about the things you are not familiar with yet as you are clearly not being threatening and actually looking to build a working relationship that both of you benifit from.

This also goes both ways. I also offer to help people to learn more about my side of the organization, going as far as being a mentor. A former coworker, with whom I am still friends with today, I met at a previous role where she was in marketing but wanted to know more about the development side, having had no prior experience. I was able to get her started in software engineering. Fast forward 6 years, she’s now the lead automations engineer for a marketing company.

I had this happen to me too. I started researching a solution for a different department and was told to stop and get back to my own work.

I'm pretty sure I wouldn't wander off the path in Yellowstone due to the fact that there are grizzlies, wolves, and other such fauna.

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