Comment by NoMoreNicksLeft | Hacker News Reader

Comment by NoMoreNicksLeft | Hacker News Reader

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NoMoreNicksLeft

> Ostensibly education is why the schools exist.

Does anyone actually believe this? It would be more than naive to do so. On r/teachers just the other day, I was reading about one of them complaining that all they really are, are baby-sitters so they parents can work dayshift. Even they know what they're for.

But if everyone were to suddenly be willing to speak this truth aloud, it'd be too absurd to continue. People are shamed and guilted into paying the taxes for education. No one could be shamed or guilted into paying for someone else's teenager daycare.

> The math situation is a clear signal that school administration/education departments do not prioritize education, and in fact find it unfair that some students actually manage to learn something, and want to stop that.

I was in first grade in 1980 (1981?). It was like this for me the entire run of it. Wanting to learn more, hungry for it, with them rationing what I could learn to tiny little crumbs a few times throughout the school year. Studies were paced out for the dumbest kid in class. I think I made it to my sophomore year of highschool before I gave up, and when I did, that was my fault too.

It was bad even then, and at least back then they were still pretending that it was about education.

>Does anyone actually believe this? It would be more than naive to do so.

GP clearly believes it, since they wrote this. I believe it too, and I think this is a mainstream belief, not a "more than naive" one. Your one anecdote based on a Reddit rant (and, I assume, personal bias) is not nearly convincing enough to change my mind.

I would not dispute that it's a mainstream belief. But I don't think that this has ever been a good counter-argument to "it's a naive belief".

My anecdote, such as it is, is hardly uncommon. It is in fact, nearly a cliche at this point, or a stereotype. I sincerely doubt that me having communicated it to you is your first encounter with the idea.

As to your mind, I don't wish to change it. I am content with you remaining naive. My own children receive advantage from this. Please continue to screw up the public education system for decades, my entire lineage can only prosper the longer this continues.

> On r/teachers just the other day, I was reading about one of them complaining that all they really are, are baby-sitters so they parents can work dayshift. Even they know what they're for.

So we're clear, when a teacher complains about being daycare, what they mean is they're:

   - an educator
   - an administrative assistant
   - daycare

The first of those is a reasonable expectation of the job. The second two, less-so.

And so you complain about the unreasonable things, but don't mention the reasonable one... because it's literally the job.

Taking kvetching about ancillary mandates to mean that education isn't happening or isn't still the primary job is weird.

That isn't what the person meant. They pointed out, clearly, multiple times, that though they were trained as an educator, no education takes place. Leaving only the "daycare" part.

When someone disputes this, what they really mean is that they are uncomfortable with the realization that it is daycare, that it hurts them to consider that something so profoundly part of their status quo is rotten to the core, and it makes their own lives seem dishonest. They would rather than misperception that education still occurs to persist unchallenged.

> because it's literally the job.

Hasn't been, for years. It's not improving/reverting. You're willfully blind to it.

> or isn't still the primary job is weird.

Please don't mistake me. I'm not claiming that education has been secondary to other concerns. I'm saying that it doesn't happen at any significant rate at all, isn't in anyone's list of priorities, and that when it does happen it is accidental and unrepeatable.

> When someone disputes this, what they really mean is that they are uncomfortable with the realization that it is daycare, that it hurts them to consider that something so profoundly part of their status quo is rotten to the core, and it makes their own lives seem dishonest. They would rather than misperception that education still occurs to persist unchallenged.

Or, they disagree, and they have their own thoughts.

> Please don't mistake me. I'm not claiming that education has been secondary to other concerns. I'm saying that it doesn't happen at any significant rate at all, isn't in anyone's list of priorities, and that when it does happen it is accidental and unrepeatable.

As someone with two parents, multiple family members, and past partners in the profession of education, early childhood and other... we will have to agree to disagree.

I'm sure your opinions are formed from your own experiences.

Mine disagree.

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