Hacker News Reader

Comment by smeej | Hacker News Reader

I tested them out loud in the context of sentences: "Can I get some ham on that sandwich?" and "Did you get your kid a hamster?" and the "ham" part still sounds exactly the same to me.

It could definitely be an accent or something that I just happen not to have heard much. It just surprised me that I couldn't think of what difference the author was thinking there might be.

View on HN

I pronounce the vowels in Mary, marry, and merry differently— like mail, marathon, and merit– but apparently that's not true in many places in the US. My regional accent is pretty mild, but I did grow up in a famously heavily accented area.

Boston by chance?

Yes MA, but closer to RI, which is fairly different in some ways. The closest famous example is Emeril Lagasse, who most people assume is from New York. One big factor is the short O pronunciation being a lot rounder. Coffee is cawfee, like it is closer to NYC.

We're talking about allophonic differences here, which are notoriously hard for native speakers to hear.

How well do you hear the difference between the /p/ sounds in words like pill, pat, punk vs. spill, spat and spunk?

Not very well at all. I barely even think of P as having its own sound at all. It has an air puffing sound, but the vowel is the only difference I actually hear with those words.

Ok, that almost certainly means you can't hear the difference between the aspirated and unaspirated allophones. That's absolutely typical of native speakers: they can't hear the difference between allophones.

Now try standing in front of a mirror, and hold a Kleenex (tissue...) in front of your mouth while pronouncing those words. You'll probably see a tiny flutter when pronouncing 'spill', 'spy' etc., but a large movement when pronouncing 'pill', 'pie' etc. The tissue is showing a difference that your ears have a hard time with. Not because the difference is hard to hear--a Thai speaker would have no problem--but because the sounds are allophonic in English (but phonemic in Thai).

Reply on news.ycombinator.com