"Having someone - doesn’t have to be religious to be clear - who has been in those rooms can be helpful."
Starting a flame about religion is very not appropriate. Please don't do that.
I just want religion left out of such topics, because it makes everything worse.
No evidence based medical treatment has ever been improved (reasonable definitions like longevity and real metrics like numbers) by making it religious. The same goes for every human endeavor, religion taints and drags.
At its core religion is belief before evidence and that simply isn't a path to long term progress.
"Eschew flamebait. Avoid generic tangents. Omit internet tropes."
"Please don't use Hacker News for political or ideological battle. That tramples curiosity."
>Sometimes, this is the gift of having a trained chaplain, pastor
oh, yeah?
For example your categorization of "cannot tell fantasy from reality" would not be a good description of say a buddhist."
Equally binding a view of mental health to religion seems a stretch. Perhaps you have experienced that, but I suspect that connection is not universal.
I didn't downvote you, I say these things to explain why you likely were downvoted. Not because your post was about religion, but because your viewpoint is both unnecessarily broad, and kinda missed the point.
The point was that having an experienced advocate on your side, who understands the process, who isn't under the mental strain of a recent terminal diagnosis, can assist you with good decisions.
If you are in a community of faith, and it's likely that the leaders in that community have walked this path before. If you are not then seek that person from wherever you are in community.
I am saying that in the US the stigma against taking mental health seriously is structural. Consider the amount of voters who think demonic possession is real (tens of millions of people) don't vote to fund mental health services. There are millions of our fellow Americans who are real people and think mental illness is punishment from god or think homosexuality or transexuality is a choice and a sin. We shouldn't start on abortion, but every argument against choice has its roots in religion.
These people have made a huge impact on healthcare and baked in tons of little decisions into healthcare that impact all of everytime we interact with the healthcare system. Live in a state where depression meds aren't covered, or maybe only some are? Might be them?
Clearly I am discussing in the US context, as such buddhism isn't a practical and a corner-case. You can pretend I am not referring to it (even though reincarnation is clearly problematic for people attached to this life based on evidence).
Certainly the US Christian approach to mental health US not reflective of non US Christians and certainly not other religions.
My experience of US Christians is that most operate in good faith, and are as open to good mental health as any other group. Some proportion, a particularly vocal portion, have weird views about lots of things.
People who think demonic possession is real (again, I am asserting tens of millsions of americans and probablly close to a billion worldwide) are operating in good faith. They actually think that stuff is real and think that locking up or torturing mentally ill people is a good solution. They honestly that actually think torturing people to remove demons is good because they believe in things like souls and think these have a role to play in medicine.
> Narrowing the context from "religion" to US Christianity certainly changes the scope of your comment.
Yes, it does, but this US centric very capitalistic place to discuss tech stuff. So I am just trying to exclude fantasy because with how much we know it can't help more than it hurts.
So anytime you bring up your religion I can't tell which end of this gradient you're on. And it's also a gradient that you're choosing to be on and a gradient that you're choosing to bring up.
If you don't think the fantastical elements matter then don't bring them up and don't defend them. If you do think of the elements matter, then I humbly request evidence and will change my mind when you present it. If you want to discuss reality then we can do that without any religion being involved, and that is sort of what the laws of most reasonable places demand when making policy. And if you think that the Fantastical parts of religion haven't impacted law in your area than either you're a very lucky person and don't live in any country I'm aware of or you simply haven't realized how much religion has made your country worse.
> you simply haven't realized how much religion has made your country worse.
https://www.amazon.com.au/Dominion-Christian-Revolution-Rema...
I understood OP’s general point as: bringing religion, particularly US Christianity, into life and death decisions is fraught due to its practitioners’ general and typical inability to separate fantasy from reality. With the disclaimer that there are always degrees and exceptions. Sure, it’s a spicy take, but I don’t think he needs to get piled on like he has in this thread.
i don't think that is proven, nor true. simply begging the question.
to hear you debate, it's as if you believe that generally anyone in the role of chaplain, minister, priest is obviously a schizophrenic nut job (general and typical inability to separate fantasy from reality). one of these days, i hope, you will find out that there are people, of all religions, that live for nothing except to help others. why insult them?