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So is it perfectly normal for a civilian vehicle to just be blocking a street at a 90 degree angle during an active ICE operation where there are other protestors present?
“Deliberately antagonizing” might be an explanation, perhaps “unintentional but poorly timed three point turn” is another. Either way, it’s interfering with the operation.
> You just believe the law is a post-hoc rationalization for murder by the state
No, I believe that Pierson v. Ray allows law enforcement the ability to be shielded from certain laws if the legality of the action is unclear or if it’s a reasonable human response within the circumstances. I don’t agree with it (as I said and you of course ignored). However that’s the law and it was an 8-1 SCOTUS decision…so it’s unlikely to change.
The person who murdered her's unmarked vehicle was blocking the road so she stopped before going into the oncoming lane.
If you drive down a random street and there is a random truck in the middle, and lots of government officers, would you stop, or just drive through them without assessing the situation? Should you be killed if, in that situation, you stop instead of what, ramming through the truck blocking the road?
If a cop car is blocking the road, and there are cops standing around, should I just swerve around the cop car without slowing down, stopping to make sure it's safe to pass? If I stop to assess if I should pass in the oncoming lane, should I be murdered? Arresting for impeding the cop?
That is what 'If you want to avoid the tragedies, avoid the situations where they can arise' refers to. Driving down a street in America. Driving down a fucking street in America deserves death in your book. Check yourself bro. You are lost as fuck.
Bro, you aren't anti qualified immunity, you are totally cool with it. You are cool with this mother being murdered, and her daughter left an orphan tonight, because she did what she was shouted at by the officers to do, which was 'move move move'.
You are OK with it today, because it is in alignment with your politics. Yesterday the right said J6 was a peaceful march, today a mom following basic traffic safety and the 'move move move' command yelled by government employees at her deserves being murdered because she 'move move move'd.'
This is what murder looks like: https://ibb.co/7J2NK4Dn
> You are cool with this mother being murdered, and her daughter left an orphan tonight,
Nope, quite the opposite, I’m just not caught up in the heat of the moment they way you are.
When this is evaluated legally your emotion will not be taken into account. I specifically left emotion out of my observation and kept my observation as coldly specific as possible because that is how this will play out legally. Unless something changes drastically, no criminal legal ramifications will come of this.
> You are OK with it today, because it is in alignment with your politics
Nope again. My politics run across a spectrum and don’t directly align with any party. Recently I think the democrats have descended into utter lunacy, but GOP candidates almost never get my vote. In fact, in the last 15 years only a single GOP politician has gotten my vote and only because I knew his opponent personally and specifically voted against him.
Lol. And there we have it :)
So easy to not be emotional when your enemies are the ones being killed I guess ;)
You should probably not have stopped reading after “my vote”. You could have read further to the point where I described only voting GOP candidate once in the last 15 years…and only then because I was voting against his opponent who I knew personally, and because of that I knew they were corrupt. Perhaps I should have voted for the crook so I passed your acid test of democratic purity?
Bro you shit posted FAFO to a 37 year old mom being murdered because she turned down a street that ice randomly had an unmarked car parked in the middle of. You aren't rational. You aren't middle of the road. You literally smuggly posted FAFO as your response to a mom with her call full of her childs stuffies, because she drove down the wrong street and ended up blocked by an unmarked car. That isn't normal, that isn't American. Like I said, check yourself, because you are lost. I left California for a red red state because I was middle. I know what 'middle' means. Middle means default being against arbitrary federal government use of force, especially when lethal. You can lie to yourself that you are middle. Don't lie to me, thanks.
Your totally rational position: If ICE blocks the road with an unmarked car like in this case, if you stop, you are interfering with their activities. If you don't stop, you are a threat to their life and they can kill you.
Normal people get emotional when that becomes the new normal from their government. Not post FAFO. And you never address anything contradictory to your position. You are purely posting talking points. You aren't middle of the road. You are all in on this. You own it as much as any MAGA bro.
ARMED GOVERNMENT AGENTS YELLED AT HER TO MOVE MOVE MOVE. THE AGENT IN QUESTION VIOLATED HIS TRAINING AND PROCEDURE. THE AGENT IN QUESTION STEPPED UP IN NO FEAR FOR HIS LIFE WHEN SHE WAS BACKING UP, HE DID NOT MOVE AWAY LIKE SOMEONE IN FEAR WOULD. SHE WAS A RANDOM MOM THAT DROVE DOWN THE WRONG STREET. You are a crappy American trying to justify/normalize this. You are a crappy American saying FAFO is valid procedure for law enforcement in the USA. You are allowing our country to devolve into something awful. You are cool with that. You are NOT middle of the road.
The government/cops can defend their actions without you. The middle position, and our job as Americans, is to hold our government accountable. Not justify a government where a mom can be murdered because she drove down the wrong street. You are lost. I was a libertarian dumb ass once, but I checked myself and realized I wasn't being honest. I wasn't being a good person nor American, I was being a political animal for shallow, unevenly applied weak/shallow political theory.
You and others are essentially demanding that I believe a crafted narrative here and get all pissed off about it. It’s not a narrative that appears to supported by all of the confirmed information right now (and newsflash, I am not buying every detail the government is peddling either). I have seen a few comments on here purporting some “facts” that now appear to be in contradiction to some witness statements (non-ice/government and are protestors) on video that have even come out today.
That is the problem with crafting a narrative…sometimes information comes out and gets in the way of the story you want to tell. Lots of things being claimed in this crafted narrative (both yours and the governments) are easily proven or disproven and I am sure will be before this issue reaches a conclusion.
Bear in mind what I initially did here was posted was an assessment of what I observed in a video and how what was present within that video will likely make it difficult to get that agent’s qualified immunity waived and explained why. I have also responded to others who are suggesting violence as a response, countering that using your vote to change is the better way to go. You have probably seen me comment that when valid laws are being enforced, that interference with that enforcement can create problems for those doing the interference. You have seen me comment that we are where we are because America voted how it voted.
I stand by all of that no matter what the eventual conclusion of this event turns out to be.