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Comment by haunter | Hacker News Reader

I've yet to see an actual premium EV akin to the ICE cars from Lexus, Acura, or Genesis.

In fact that's my problem with all EVs because EVEN Lexus, Acura, and Genesis is not sticking to their premium quality when they release an EV version of their ICE cars. The Lexus ES ICE is legendary. The Lexus ES EV looks like a plastic coffin with 2 tablets. It's probably the zeigeist of car designs and/or my taste but I feel all EVs look the same without much personality. Not even mentioning the chinese brands because Geely, Leapmotor, BYD etc all look the same to me.

Say we have a Lexus LX 600 https://www.lexus.com/models/LX Why does this car can't be released as is, the same design and same interior but with an EV drivetrain?

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There is staggering number of consumer debt in us because people buy luxury cars they can’t afford. We don’t need more 100k evs. We need 20k evs.

It is consistently funny / revealingly human the lengths people will go to bad-mouth something they're irrationally biased against in order to not appear irrationally biased.

My extended family has three EVs now, and they're fucking great for our needs. They get us to where we need to go, and save us at least $350 a month in fuel.

Having said that, we're in the exact scenario pocket where EVs make sense: We can charge at home overnight, our daily commutes are 50km maximum, we have solar panels and cheap overnight electricity rates, we don't need to tow anything pretty much ever.

EVs are less niche than they were, but they're still not as commodity/utility friendly as ICE cars, but the niche is growing quickly. Interestingly, the haters I've encountered rapidly soften when they actually experience driving in an EV - they're still a ways away from looking to buy one for themselves, but they're noticeably less militantly/irrationally opposed than they were.

Caveat: 1 of the EVs is a 2014 Nissan Leaf, which is at about 80% of its original range. The other two are less than a year old Chinese EVs, and so I can't and won't speak to long term reliability - that's definitely a risk we were willing to take, and won't know whether it was worth it until a few years down the track.

Have you had a chance to ride in the Chinese EVs? Opinions on exterior designs are pretty subjective and change a lot over time (see: Porsche 996). I've driven and ridden in a lot of Chinese EVs over the past two years and find them much more luxurious than ICE cars across the price range. Most of them have huge panoramic sunroofs now that make even the small cars feel open and spacious, the technology is actually useful instead of a gimmick (Chinese navigation apps are way better than western ones, which is a big deal when the primary interface is a tablet), many of the cars can autopark/drive, they have cameras for all the blind spots, USB-c and magnetic chargers everywhere, fast charging, etc. etc.

I would encourage anyone that lives in America or Europe and hasn't been to China in the past five years to go see it for yourself. Take what western media writes with a grain of salt - you might be surprised.

Car makers can't win! Release an EV with "personality" aka looks different from an ICE, and people will complain why can't they make an EV that looks like a normal car. Release an EV that looks like a normal ICE and someone's going to complain it has no personality. Ah well.

The 'personality', that EVs used to seemingly be designed with, seemed universally ugly for a long time. Nissan Leaf (I own one, so familiarity has softened my opinion), Toyota Prius, BMW i3, all fucking ugly cars. It was like they didn't want to sell them in order to justify not putting further R&D into them, or they wanted to see how committed the market was, despite the butt-ugliness.

Current era is SUV-look for almost literally every car (even the Mini has the 'Countryman' variant, which makes a mockery of the very name 'Mini'), so EVs have essentially followed that bland-ness to now be leading it.

Polestar's are the nicest looking EVs, outside of the high-level performance cars that are out of the practical range of normal people.

It's as if the world is filled with many people with lots of different opinions

I struggled to find anyone that found the older-school EVs anything but look-away ugly.

The BMW i4 is probably what you're looking for.

I think it's a huge regression vs. the goofy looking i3 (which is carbon fiber, has a working jog wheel, etc). The i4 is basically exactly a modern BMW sedan, but an EV. I think they moved to a platform that lets them just switch between ICE, hybrid and EV. You can even set the safety tone to make it sound like a BMW with tuned exhaust pipes.

My i3 is my favorite car ever. If it looked like a BMW I would have never considered it. The i3 is such a pure design statement. The only other ev I would describe that way is the now defunct Canoo.

They look like a swollen, but also squashed, BMW. Gross. But gross has its own appeal to vanishingly small minority of people. Like cats with the squashed up snouts. Cute, in a distinctly not-pretty way.

Having said that, I like the (hatch-size more-so than the SUV-size) GWM Ora, which seems to be a divisive looking EV.

It has an amazing turning radius. Impressive acceleration from 0-35. Exactly where I need steller acceleration. I-drive is a great UI device for driving. The screens are all well thought out. Very specious inside with cargo space and wide hatchback opening.

Luxury seems like a tricky move for EVs. All those extra features add weight, which eats into range. I would guess that undermines your own sales pitch because people who want to spend a lot on their car are generally going to be people who expect to spend a lot of time in their car.

I imagine it's just a fundamentally more palatable compromise for an ICE vehicle. You maybe bump the size of the fuel tank a bit and assume your clientele aren't going to be all that much more cost sensitive about fuel than they are about sticker price and maintenance.

The Cadillac Escalade IQ is… a Cadillac Escalade with an electric powertrane. It is as nice as any of the brands mentioned.

The Lucid gravity is in the same discussion.

Lexus is releasing the TZ which is the equivalent to the TX gasser.

> yet to see an actual premium EV akin

thats because there is zero demand as has been all over the news the past years. the european and especially german car industry wasted billions on EV strategies that now have to be rewound because it turns out there is basically zero demand for expensive EVs. people that can afford expensive cars want ICE.

Have you looked at Polestars? They're nicer than any ICE car I've ever driven.

Chased out of the USA by policy decisions.

> an actual premium EV

Porsche Taycan.

> EV akin to the ICE cars from [...] Genesis.

What about the EV Genesis? I personally couldn't see the difference between the ICE and electrified G80.

Otherwise, what about the Taycan?

The Taycan is the perfect answer to someone who's concerned that modern EVs aren't expensive enough.

If you buy it new sure; Porsches are always very expensive.

But you can get very good second hand ones for less than $70k; that should definitely fit OP's requirements.

>I've yet to see an actual premium EV akin to the ICE cars from Lexus, Acura, or Genesis.

I drive a Polestar 4, which stands up very nicely to any Lexus/Genesis/Acura. So does the Lucid.

Not to mention the Porsche Taycan. And the Macan EV is essentially the same as their ICE Macan.

Maybe you don't like EVs - that's fine. Everyone has their taste. After switching to an EV I'm never going back to an ICE car again.

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