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Comment by ck2 | Hacker News Reader

voting should be frictionless and not have to go anywhere

it's a constitutional right, not something you should have to jump through hoops

people don't have the time to take off work and not get paid and wait in line for hours which is exactly what many places do now by reducing voting location radically

many people can't even afford a car these days or to fill it with gas

if you insist on in person voting, make it a paid day off

the ID thing is a false narrative, it's not ID that's the problem, it's that it costs money to get the ID and now they want your birth certificate saying the ID doesn't even prove you are a citizen with "realID"

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We accept a degree of friction for other constitutional entitlements.

Buying a gun, free speech, right to assembly. Each with caveats.

Appearing in front of your fellow citizens as a breathing person is central to how voting has worked for hundreds of years.

Why change it?

I agree it should be paid day off.

I don't think people who want to exercise their first or second amendment right accept friction over it. In fact it seems to me that's been one major source of political unrest.

But those same people who don't want their first and second amendment rights to be infringed are okay with voting having high friction so a lot of people can't do it.

When you say "why change it" are you not aware that many US states vote by mail (and/or ballot drop boxes) and have for decades? Or are you ignoring it?

Yes I'm aware. By change it I mean the gradual shift from in person to mailed ballets. This is shift toward isolation. Bubble preservation.

Standing inline with your neighbors to exercise our vote is empowering. It reminds us of our status as voters. As equals. It crosses boundaries. It's beautiful.

Sure there's cases where appearing in person isn't practical and I'm not suggesting we close the door to that. But I think it should be needs based.

I appreciate the vibe you're going for, but standing in line with your neighbors is also a massive time sink that directly costs people money via lost wages. Making drop-box voting needs-based just places democratic participation in the hands of those who determine who 'needs' and why. A democracy is only as real as its citizens' access to ballots.

Any friction must be weighed against the harm it seeks to prevent.

There simply is no meaningful intentional voter fraud in the US.

I agree. But I also like the ceremony.

In an even more online and disconnected world, it forces us out of our homes to stand with our neighbors in an exercise of our power.

There's a beauty to this that, when a large amount of voting is done over mail, I feel is lost.

I personally would prefer in person on a national holiday with civic groups (eg Boy Scouts) selling hotdogs.

Obtaining an ID card in most developed democracies costs money, sometimes modest fees, sometimes rather hefty fees.

In the US, the 24th Amendment makes it illegal to charge people a tax to vote:

https://constitution.congress.gov/constitution/amendment-24/

> The right of citizens of the United States to vote in any primary or other election for President or Vice President, for electors for President or Vice President, or for Senator or Representative in Congress, shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or any State by reason of failure to pay any poll tax or other tax.

Any states requiring a particular kind of ID for voting have to make a suitable ID available for free, they cannot charge for it or it becomes a de facto poll tax. That means that while they may accept a driver's license or passport (which cost, at least in every state I know of DLs aren't free), they also have to have some suitable free ID (other than the time to obtain it). But even the time to obtain an ID can become subject to lawsuits against states if they try to play games with it like closing down DMV locations or cutting down on operating hours to make it harder for people to obtain the necessary ID.

Time (and transportation) are very real barriers for the working poor, the disabled, and others.

You missed the part where registering to vote requires ID in the first place, so the only thing being added are opportunities to deny the right to vote which has already been asserted.

Insult to injury is the additional administrative burden of voter registration.

It's a database query to generate a list of eligible voters and where they can vote. Literally.

Bonus points for maintaining 50+ heterogeneous legally separated voter registration databases. Thereby maximizing the likelihood of errors. Plus every VRDB has one or more teams of saboteurs; purging eligible voters, monkey wrenching, and sowing FUD.

...it's almost as if the there's some far reaching, widespread campaign to disenfranchise voters.

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