Comment by avar | Hacker News Reader

Comment by avar | Hacker News Reader

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From the perspective of someone living in mainland Europe the legislation around bars in the U.S. is quite baffling.

I was over in San Francisco last summer and walked out of a bar pint in hand to tag along for a cigarette break, we were promptly chastised about it. I apologized saying that I'd briefly forgotten what continent I was on.

It's also not unusual to see children milling around with their parents in bars in Europe well into the evening. There's no demand that you have to be of drinking age to be in the establishment, just that you can't be sold drinks if that's not the case.

All in all it contributes to a more relaxed atmosphere around drinking and I suspect to overall moderation and safety around drinking.

If you ban guns in bars then someone who carries a gun around anyway will have to stash it somewhere before they arrive, or risk breaking the law.

I carry a swiss army knife on my keychain because it's a useful tool, I bring that to bars I go to. I don't think I'm any more likely to attempt to stab someone after a few pints than I otherwise would.

To be fair, I've never trimmed stray clothing thread, monkeyed with a car part, or fixed, well, anything with my concealed carry .357. It makes a lot more sense to disallow firearms in bars as they have no constructive purpose at all. The same is not true for a swiss army knife; it is most certainly both a tool and a weapon.

Still, I totally agree with you. The stringent attitude towards alcohol-serving in the United States does stigmatize it's consumption quite a bit, and, IMO, causes a decrease in moderation and safety when compared to a more relaxed Europe.

I do think teenagers should learn to drink with their parents. They should be taught to be responsible with their drinking. The current system creates so much expectation, they learn to drink among other teenagers, that is pretty crazy.

edit:spelling

> If you ban guns in bars then someone who carries a gun around anyway will have to stash it somewhere before they arrive, or risk breaking the law.

Coat check for guns? A peace tie (zip-tie) on the holster? It's not like this isn't a well understood problem.

The first option could lead to easier theft of the gun, putting guns into the wrong hands; it also means bars have to be responsible for something they may not want to deal with for moral or political (i.e., PR) grounds; the second amounts to a stigmatization of gun owners in the form of an undue burden upon them and no one else.

Make what you will of those arguments, but note both options could also be applied to car keys of people entering a bar (check your keys so we can evaluate your intoxication before giving them back). In fact, one could note that cars are a tool much much more often used by the intoxicated to murder (commit manslaughter, if you like).

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