We should not work to equalize men and women objectively. What we need to do is make sure that our daughters and sisters have the same opportunities that they would have if they were men, and aren't prejudiced by what society tells them to be.
We should not work to equalize men and women objectively. What we need to do is make sure that our daughters and sisters have the same opportunities that they would have if they were men, and aren't prejudiced by what society tells them to be.
That's a terrible way of thinking about it. Unless some difference is proven to be biological, we should certainly assume it is not. That's how we deal everything else that has to do with technology: unless something is proven to be impossible, we try as hard as we can to achieve it. Some people believe cryonic re-animation is possible, and some people believe in indefinite extension of life or even uploading one's mind to a computer. If those notions are credible enough for technologists to put a lot of effort into achieving, then surely something as simple as equal representation for all groups in the seats of power is something we must work towards, no?
Many differences have been proven to be biological.
> unless something is proven to be impossible
But what is your goal? Is your goal just for that number? What if parity is not better? What if the problem of parity is that there is something intrinsic in women that they're just not stupid enough to work 80 hours a week for 3-5 years to have a chance at a few million dollar exit? What if women just tend to not have the same values as men do during the time when their career priorities are most important?
It's much more important that a woman can become a CEO if she has the skills and desire than that 50% of CEOs are women.
> equal representation for all groups in the seats of power
I think you start to tread into different territory here. While I don't believe that half of the women on the board of a company need necessarily be women, I do believe that half(ish) of the women on any sort of government body should be women.
Absolutely none that are pertinent to the matter at hand.
> What if the problem of parity is that there is something intrinsic in women that they're just not stupid enough to work 80 hours a week for 3-5 years to have a chance at a few million dollar exit?
Sure. And what if it's impossible to find intelligence in the universe, create true AI and extend life? There are good signs that that's indeed the case. I guess you would argue we should stop pursuing those goals.
> I do believe that half(ish) of the women on any sort of government body should be women.
And don't you think Silicon Valley is a center of concentrated power?
And it's clear those things impact participation in startups.
[1]http://edge.org/event/the-science-of-gender-and-science-pink...
First, are you saying that whatever "differences in risk preference" found (for some definition of "good level evidence": I haven't seen the studies, but I'm sure they weren't done on, say, a sample of a ten-thousand people) account for the huge difference seen in SV startups? I mean, I don't know what the effect size was in the studies you were referring to, but I'm sure it was nowhere near that we see in SV.
I call such an attitude "sciency" -- ascribing small-n studies with low effect size the scientific rigor of proof or strong evidence to reinforce existing biases. You will never seriously consider this level of evidence "good" if something important to you depended on it.
Second, and much more importantly: even pretending those studies were conducted on a billion people and showed a 5x difference (or whatever it is among SV entrepreneurs), all it means is that this is how people behave now.
Sociology doesn't purport to be physics, and those aren't laws of nature. I mean, you could have done literacy studies in the 1800s and shown that blacks are illiterate (with much more statistical rigor, BTW); what does that mean? You must remember that sociology (and often psychology) studies snapshots of society that are a result of forces that we have the power to change (and probably the moral obligation to). Sociology studies things so that we could change them. It doesn't claim (in fact, it claims the opposite) to uncover fixed laws of nature.
And secondly i'm not saying they account for all the differences in SV, just that there are large biologically based differences.
What I find most disturbing is the "sciency" reliance of people on studies showing small effect size as an excuse to not even try to change an unfair power structure, and ignore the findings showing cultural impact. I mean, even if it's not possible to erase any-and-all difference, shouldn't we at least try to eliminate some? If anything, you're showing a clear cultural bias by treating this situation differently from other scientific findings.
Also, how do you explain the constant decline, since at least the 1980s, of women participation in CS?
Or to phrase the question in a different way. If risk behavior is a socially learned behavior, and risk behavior is the cause of gender imbalance in SV entrepreneurs, what would the ethical action be to create equal opportunity for people of both genders?
Let's ask the question another way: if schools (and parents) are currently educating boys to take more risk (or educating girls to take less risk), should they start treating both sexes the same way?
What schools could do is educate about actually risks, so that any personal or cultural level of risk aversion is confronted with reality. That would be treating children of both genders equally and could mitigate differences between genders.
Those biases are subtextual, but very powerful. There's a nice recent article demonstrating some of them: http://www.slate.com/articles/technology/bitwise/2014/12/wom...
Risk tolerance leads boys and some girls to take stupid risks from adolescence to? Well, for boys, over-representation in correctional institutions.
If one could just get all to avoid stupid risks but take other more acceptable risks, I suppose but can they be decoupled?
This is not to say that oppotunities should not be there for all to consider and take, if they so desire... just making risk in general more acceptable can have unintended consequences --unless there is a way to direct the risk energy into productive avenues (i.e more job risk tolerance but less risk of engaging in dangerous activities..
These are scientific endeavors. If you want to try and get to the heart of why men are so much more prevalent than women in successful SV exits, be my guest, but that would be a scientific goal.
Trying to force the model of what you think the world should be is not scientific, it's ideological - even if that ideology were to be backed up by science. In your case, it isn't.
They are absolutely not (well, except for ETI)! They are technological goals, some funded by private businesses with monetary interests (i.e., they are driven by values).
And besides, what is it that you're saying? That in order to increase our knowledge of the universe we must stop at nothing, but when it comes to sharing power and improving the lives of disenfranchised groups we must stop... well, right here would be good?
> Absolutely none that are pertinent to the matter at hand.
Are you saying that a propensity for risk-taking is unrelated to gender or that it's not pertinent to entrepreneurship?
Being a dick to women is what misogynists do. Feminists want to do away with sexism, which is a set of systemic (usually unconscious) biases deeply engrained in culture. So the goal is to do away with sexism, and that, in turn, would probably result in a much more equal distribution.
yep. A real representative democracy is when for any government body of size N (city council, state House, etc...) and for any trait being present in more than 1/N share of the population governed by the body such trait must be possessed by a member of the body. If the trait is present in more than 2/N share of the population - then at least 2 member must possess it, etc...
So unless I can scientifically prove that "men are better than women at American football" I should assume that talent is equally distributed? Your statement is very politically correct but it seems to me that your null hypothesis was selected due to ideology. The problem I have with it is that if you are incorrect, your statement is essentially unfalsifiable.
It's not a null hypothesis (we're not talking about conducting an experiment but deciding on a policy) but a value statement. Like all values -- including those at the core of startup culture and "disruption" -- it, too, is based on ideology. I believe this ideology is far superior to an alternative one (that would choose to preserve the current power structure where whole groups of people are allocated less power than some others).
> whole groups of people are allocated less power than some others
I'm not sure if you're using "allocated" in a technical way that I'm not familiar with, but to me the word "allocated" implies some level of top-down distribution of a limited resource. I don't think it's an accurate way to think about things (wealth is not a zero-sum game).
Of course! But choosing to emphasize this value and to identify the exact nature of the problem (let alone acknowledge its undesired existence) are prerequisites. This[1] is a nice recent article showing the problem (and, by extension, suggesting solutions).
> I'm not sure if you're using "allocated" in a technical way that I'm not familiar with, but to me the word "allocated" implies some level of top-down distribution of a limited resource. I don't think it's an accurate way to think about things (wealth is not a zero-sum game).
I was not referring to a centralized distribution (and neither was I talking about wealth alone, though wealth, and probably power, while not quite "zero-sum" are probably quite finite), but to a property, a snapshot if you will, of our society as it currently exists.
[1]: http://www.slate.com/articles/technology/bitwise/2014/12/wom...
To what end, in programming, would this be important. To what end, in the field that women invented, would this be important?