bengale

Yeah that all sounds very familiar.

At the last large traditional place I was at it seemed a lot like the upper management types had put these gatekeepers in place so they had people that would pander to them. The amount of times one of them told me they couldn't tell their boss some bad news for risk of getting fired or chewed out, but wouldn't let me go and tell them the truth was mad.

From what I could tell no-one was firing engineers because it was too expensive and we didn't really care since we could get more work within a few hours, and the "bosses" didn't like the lack of power they had in that dynamic.

Isn’t this largely the point of gmail? It’s a data collection tool isn’t it?

My solution for this is a headless Linux box under my desk and remote vscode and ssh from my MacBook. Best of both worlds so far for me.

I did try and use Linux full time but the UI drove me up the wall so I’m back comfortable in macOS but my dev work flies on that Linux box.

This generally my take on this too. When I see posts like this I’m never sure if I’m envious of the free time to faff about like this, or have pity that they have nothing better to do.

Yes, for the upgraded plans you can export data from all private channels and direct messages. It also doesn't notify users when this happens. You can't watch the chats in real time or anything.

People should assume communication on company services are all logged.

Yeah, we saw the real start of our growth when we hired a dedicated sales and marketing person. They didn’t take any equity and they weren’t even that expensive (ignoring commission). I’m not sure it would have made sense to bring them on as a co-founder.

Alfred seems live fine alongside spotlight too.

Yeah but I know its more of a nostalgia thing. I wouldn't trade my iPhone for one, but I would love them to have been able to exist side by side.

I’m not sure if it’s something I want to get into but I don’t really agree.

All I was saying is a policy supported by a large majority, proposed by this government, had to be walked back because of their inability to control the back benches. Boris is a piss poor leader.

Just goes to show how weak this current government is. Polls show 60% approve of the idea, with 27% opposed. Yet they still can't get their own policy done due to infighting in the tory party.

I have my hottub at 40C which is hot when you get in but comfortable to sit in for a while.

I'm surprised Ray-Ban were willing to attach their brand to this.

I would assume you'd also need to have some sort of armed forces too, otherwise whichever country wants you data can sail over with their Navy and take it.

I've yet to hear a good argument for them.

Why would it seem likely that our bodies have a way to deal with a man made substance?

6 years in the UK.

I hope this means they wont renew their agreement with Sky in the UK when that expires. I don’t want a Sky subscription but would like to sign up for HBO max over here.

I feel we're circling the same issues here so I'll leave it after this. But what you're saying is the point I'm making, many clouds have been doing this for a decade and we've not seen the issues you're worried about. The one example you gave was a photo tech, so human developing photos, making a mistake. Not someone being targeted with material that would trigger google photos or Facebook to flag them, not algorithms making mistakes with photos of someones kids, none of it.

The post we're commenting under has created hash collisions with grey blob images, if you get 100 of these they won't get past the review step anyway. It'd be a pointless attack.

Like most of the outrage around this system it mostly seems to boil down to FUD.

It's not an example though. Putting aside a lack of news report we'll assume it's true, it's got nothing to do with cloud scanning for images. A picture of someones children wouldn't trigger these systems at all.

Ok so your fear is someone will target your grandparents with child porn?

If this was such a major problem why has no-one been targeted like this in the last decade when everyone else was scanning for it?

> So someone might forward you your personal pics from your meeting with them and its pixels might get edited by the messenger app you use to save the picture into your photos to specifically collide its hash with a csam image, while to you the image will look perfectly normal

Ok, but then that image is already not private, if I've been sending it to someone that could do that.

> This is one example , lets say you 100% trust every developer of every app that you download on apple’s phone.

I don't have to, they have to ask me before storing images in my photo library. I'm not going to give some fart generator app access to my library.

> Do you now trust every single image which might get auto downloaded to your gallery by a malicious actor , what if a random anon person messages you with 100 such colliding images , enough to cross threshold to get the authorities knocking your door

Beyond the fact that nothing writes images to my library automatically. If they sent me 100 images that are grey blobs or slightly manipulated normal images they dont get past the check anyway so no police. If they send me 100 CSAM images I'll be on the phone to the police anyway.

But they won't be my private photos, the only way it gets to the point where a human see's them is that I have a bunch of child porn uploaded into iCloud, or someone puts a bunch of these grey blob images into my library. Neither of those are my images. There is no chance 30+ of my personal images have hash collisions with this database of child porn.

> How society went from keeping personal photos private

Also, didn't the local photo development shops used to call the police quite frequently when dodgy images were sent in to be developed? I remember it happening once at our local supermarket.

I don't think they will. They already scan it all in the cloud, and the benefit of doing it on device is for user privacy, that's not something google gives a shit about.

Yeah I can't decide on this one. Part of me thinks this can't be happening, and that someone would have realised. But there's been a couple of occasions that go beyond the "creepy coincidence" ads to something that I was speaking with my wife about that day and neither of us had put into the internet, suddenly we get ads for it.

I don't understand why this is a concern. Someone would need 30 or so child porn images to generate these. Then they'd need to create these grey blobs and send them to the target. The target would need to save them in their photo library for some reason so they sync to iCloud. Then when all this triggers the review they'll see they are grey blobs and nothing else will happen?

It would need to have 30 collisions before anything even took place, which realistically isn't going to happen.

Oh I see. Yeah we use google mail for our business and I use fast mail, both with custom domains.

No they are different things. CSAM detection is looking for specific images from a database before upload to iCloud photo library: https://www.apple.com/child-safety/pdf/CSAM_Detection_Techni...

The child protection part can be enabled for under 13s if they’re in a family account. If enabled messages app will try and detect adult images being sent and received and give a warning to the child, it can also let the parents know about it.

No they were only scanning iCloud email. They were lagging well behind other services in identifying this content, only finding a few hundred compared to millions by Facebook for example.

The system only works with iCloud Photo Library, it needs a server side component to continue the process.

https://www.apple.com/child-safety/pdf/CSAM_Detection_Techni...

This is a very interesting read and personally I think they’ve gone to extreme length to make this system as private as it could be.