openfuture

It is no more (or less) a religion than what we have now.

Diversity is a wonderful thing.

Science is based on ethical persuasion, where you make it clear why you believe something. The things you listed are not of that nature, they try to persuade you by appealing to authority or employing coercion of some sort.

Already commented elsewhere but this is called the oracle problem. It is essentially the tragedy of the commons w.r.t. bureaucracy; i.e. why should I be truthful about the state of the world if I can lie and make a profit because what I say will get recorded as truthful in the bureaucracy... this is the same as "corruption" and "fake news" etc.

We already know how to solve this problem fyi but it seems no one is interested in helping me implement it.

You guys can do it via amoveo. If you need veo then feel free to contact me by following links from profile to an email address.

The oracle problem rears its ugly head once more.

It's not a /nice/ DEX but amoveo exists, almost no liquidity but in theory it works.

It's not hopeless but it is important to understand how impactful solving the oracle problem would be. The implications are IMMENSE. Literally obviates the need for governance.

So idk, monero is too small (in some sense) to really be useful and the oracle problem is too big (in some sense) for a solution to it to be "one of many" - it'll transform everything and it can't happen unless people make it happen.

What he said resonates with me. I take the same stance and there is nothing you can exclude me from that will hurt me. If I'd lose a job or the chance to get a job because of this attitude then I'd be happy to not be put into that anxiety-inducing context. Actually, I'd rather die than be a part of this coercive system that manufactures problems so I am a bit on the hardcore side (especially since this has been put to the test and I have in fact almost died for this reason).

Frustrating thing is that "if you want to go far go together" so everyone needs to finish converging before we can move on.

Here is my lie: https://sr.ht/~ilmu/tala.saman/

"Time theft"?! Oof I sincerely hope he got that the right way around rather than predictably inverting it.

Who knows if anything is finished anyway? So long as you live you can continue and the definitions are always in flux / personal.

I believe the one who feels the strongest pull should work on manifesting a vision, not the one who had the idea; i.e. if someone says "it'd be nice to have cake" and another goes "omfg yes that would be the best" then who should make it? They could do it together but if the first person shops for ingredients and then decides they'd rather go to hawaii for a bit then the second person can still make the cake and eat it without the world burning down.

My hypothesis is that people who write code for fun don't read docs and people who do read docs are the types to 'about' things rather than 'do' things.

The list is pretty good, although I am still in favor of good docs since software is not only supposed to be used, it's also there to be studied by future people who want to learn new ideas.. I loved reading manuals for programming languages for more than a decade, but now I am a bit bored with the genre, writing software has also become a bit more fun than before... I'm sure these things correlate.

I left this thread alone since it is a rabbithole but I was surprised how monotonous it ended up being. The datastructure I am quite interested in these days is 'concept lattices' and object-property (bi)graphs. Although I am less interested in the dynamic side atm and am more thinking about representation of data while being exchanged.

We just need to go p2p, spend five minutes thinking what that means (or read my scattered thoughts) and the culture change becomes obvious.

Central planners 2.0, welcome to the soviet union.

Maybe I am just trolling a bit because I saw a bunch of these kinds of replies and I wanted to subvert the trope a bit.

But I am referencing daoism rather than zen.

I'm claiming science used to be more decentralized and that it is less so now.

"What destroys trust?" is an abstract question, social media is a factor but not the only one.

Nice, good news. The competition authority was revamped post financial crysis and has some good people at the helm.

The CEO that is being interviewed there was in the panama papers. He bought the house he lives in from the wife of one of the people who was jailed after the financial crysis.

The people who were jailed didn't really receive much time at all and the whole thing has been misunderstood abroad.

Honestly the country is no longer independent, the biggest joke is that our ruling political party, the independence party, is anything but...

But these things are just the slow march to making it clear who rules us. Can't wait to see the identity company (also private) being sold in a similar way.

I am doing an uprising (except the icelandic word 'uppreisn' also has the added meaning of 'dignity') - what does that entail? Well I believe that coercion is not a good foundation for anything supposedly legitimate. I want a more persuasive foundation and I guess that starts with making guix a useful OS for non-technical users via my "datalisp" project... I guess I should stop dragging my feet and make the website (datalisp.is) since I am opening this discussion.

Whatever. The key idea is; we need to be able to trust our operating system, for that to happen we need a way to receive automatic updates without having a central source of truth, this is the oracle problem in disguise. The solution is to keep track of probabilistic estimates of [contextual] trust and basically do science (we haven't got a better way to do physics so I don't see how we are expecting anything better from "AI") to assess legitimacy...

You can see my thing at sr.ht/~ilmu and if you are Icelandic; uppreisn.is (note that this thing is lost in google translation).

I've decided I would rather die than earn money doing things I don't believe in and that almost happened recently so everything is a bit scattered. However I have a meetup starting next month and then there will be steady progress on datalisp.

Edit for some clarifications, the sale discussed is blocked right now by the 'competition control' agency but I don't think they have enough grounds and the agencies that do are clearly corrupt.

To answer your question you only need to investigate under which conditions coercion succeeds in changing behaviour.

I believe that we can dismantle the current world order by providing a more persuasive alternative. Legitimacy is not absolute, but rather relative, and currently the things built on coercion are more legitimate, that is not a law of physics (thankfully it seems to be the other way around actually).

Lol nobody touching this discussion with a however-long-you-can-think-of pole. At least not anymore.

My contribution: I think we have been destroying trust systematically for so long that people are losing their sanity. Finally it is time to rethink our foundations and stop coercing. Currently there are various things that take trust for granted and they will need to become a great deal more persuasive if they want to retain their status moving forward (examples include: governments, currrencies, science, etc. - basically central coordination built on a foundation of coercion, science was the last bastion but the "education system" has become a certification system).

I'm doing something along these lines.

Nothing.

Some people don't understand things, that is not the same as understanding nothing.

I also understand ashtanga and programming.

I am doing the somewhat opposite, I am starting a company where I will take shit as a service (and compost it).

Inevitable with bureaucracy unless we solve the oracle problem in a tragedy of the commons resistant way.

Look around. I'd rather be constructive and establish a way forward than joining the chorus of complaint.

No shit. The whole thing is basically about improving the security of the current totalitarian nightmare (i.e. economic system based on a central currency model). Real change will require a rethink of our assumptions. This is something I spend every waking moment on and I am getting close to being able to explain how we get out of this mess but give me time.

Next month I will post my own stuff in this thread but for this month I want to highlight the much more active efforts of the whereiseveryone crowd. Please join us in making guix great! https://git.sr.ht/~whereiseveryone/guixrus#manifesto

We have meetups also every month to discuss documentation and packaging. Next month I will also start a meetup for datalisp (which you could see as configuration meetup, i.e. how to run your own system).

Yeah what you are running into is the difference between the web, which is already dead and rotting, versus the internet, which is quite resilient and is in the process of eating the web.

People sometimes use weird domain specific languages, the principle of charity goes a long way in being able to understand peoples' concerns despite the weird way they communicate them. I hate how easily we dismiss people with nonstandard language usage. Grow up.

Money is persuasion. You can use it to change people's behaviour. Once people lose trust in money then it is no longer persuasive. This is when authority starts resorting to violence instead.

I feel the question highlights how stupid it is to limit yourself to a single field of study.