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skysniper

100 karma · joined March 24, 2017

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skysniper··on Opus 4.7 dominates agentic benchmark, 15% more expensive than Opus 4.6
Ran preliminary benchmarks on Opus 4.7, noticeably better than Opus 4.6, about 15% higher cost per task due to more tool calls, most performant and expensive model so far
skysniper··on GLM-5.1 matches Opus 4.6 in agentic performance, at ~1/3 actual cost
where are you Mythos
skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
check out my reply, his chart is plotting the wrong metric (average quality score)
skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
i added native plot and stats for aggregated results, on arena page. please check it out!
skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
yeah but i'm not using the free version for benchmark...
skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
added https://app.uniclaw.ai/arena/model-stats

also added per battle stats in battle detail page

skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
I know, that was indeed a bad judge move. I've manually checked tens of tasks so far, and that one is one of the worst... I would say check a few more, judge has some noise but in general did a good job IMO
skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
well, I still want to use it but the first day i tried openclaw + opus, it costs me ~$500...
skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
> The explanation is that network errors were credited with a quality score of 0, and there were _a lot_ of network errors.

all network error, provider error, openclaw error are excluded from ranking calculation actually, so that is not the reason.

Real reason:

The absolute score is not consistent across tasks and cannot be directly added/averaged, for both human and LLM. But the relative rank is stable (model A is better than B). That is exactly why Chatbot Arena only uses the relative rank of models in each battle in the first place, and why we follow that approach.

a concrete example of why score across tasks cannot be added/averaged directly: people tend to try haiku with easier task and compare with T2 models, and try opus with harder task and compare with better models.

another example: judge (human or llm) tend to change score based on opponents, like Sonnet might get 10/10 if all other opponents are Haiku level, but might get 8/10 if opponent has Opus/gpt-5.4.

So if you want to make the plot, you should plot the elo score (in leaderboard) vs average cost per task. But note: the average cost has similar issue, people use smaller model to run simpler task naturally, so smaller model's lower cost comes from two factor: lower unit cost, and simpler task.

methodology page contains more details if you are interested.

skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
I will try and add it. But I doubt it works well because Mimo V2 Pro is beaten by stepfun even at performance leaderboard (price is not a factor in this leaderboard), so I expect MiMo V2 Flash to perform even worse.
skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
TBH that was my initial thought too, but I found some problem using this approach:

Essentially I'm using the relative rank in each battle to fit a latent strength for each model, and then use a nonlinear function to map the latent strength to Elo just for human readability. The map function is actually arbitrary as long as it's a monotonically increasing function so it preserves the rank. The only reliable result (that is invariant to the choice of the function) is the relative rank of models.

That being said, if I use score/cost as metrics, the rank completely depends on the function I choose, like I can choose a more super-linear function to make high performance model rank higher in score/cost board, or use a more sub-linear function to make low performance model rank higher.

That's why I eventually tried another (the current) approach: let judge give relative rank of models just by looking at cost-effectiveness (consider both performance and cost), and compute the cost-effectiveness leaderboard directly, so the score mapping function does not affect the leaderboard at all.

skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
it's actually pretty good at openclaw type of tasks for non technical users: lots of tool calls, some simple programing
skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
what kind of tasks did you try?
skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
I appreciate honest feedback, best way to learn :)
skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
both are shown in battle detail page already. Time is shown in Scores table. Number of tokens are shown in Cost details at the bottom of the Scores. (I thought most people just want to see cost in USD so I put token details at the bottom)
skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
I should have clarified I didn't use the free version...
skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
> Is the judge an LLM?

Yes, judge is one of opus 4.6, gpt 5.4, gemini 3.1 pro (submitter can choose). Self judge (judge model is also one of the participants) is excluded when computing ranking.

> There's lot of references to "just like LMArena", but LMArena is human evaluated?

Yeah LMArena is human evaluated, but here i found it not practical to gather enough human evaluation data because the effort it take to compare the result is much higher:

- for code, judge needs to read through it to check code quality, and actually run it to see the output

- when producing a webpage or a document, judge needs to check the content and layout visually

- when anything goes wrong, judge needs to read the execution log to see whether partial credit shall be granted

if you look at the cost details of each battle (available at the bottom of battle detail page), judge typically cost more than any participant model.

if we evaluate with human, i would say each evaluation can easily take ~5-10 min

skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
another thing from the bench I didn't expect: gemini 3.1 pro is very unreliable at using skills. sometimes it just reads the skill and decide to do nothing, while opus/sonnet 4.6 and gpt 5.4 never have this issue.
skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
thanks for the info. before running the bench i only tried it in arena.ai type of tasks and it was not impressive. i didn't expect it to be that good at agentic tasks
skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
all 300+ battle data are available at https://app.uniclaw.ai/arena/battles, every single battle is shown with raw conversional history, produced files, judge's verdict and final scores
skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
the real surprising part to me is that, despite being the cheapest model on board, stepfun is often able to score high at pure performance. Other models at the same price range (e.g. kimi) fails to do that.
skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
sorry didn't know that. Here is my hand writing tldr:

gemini is very unreliable at using skills, often just read skills and decide to do nothing.

stepfun leads cost-effectiveness leaderboard.

ranking really depends on tasks, better try your own task.

skysniper··on StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effective model for OpenClaw tasks (300 battles)
I ran 300+ benchmarks across 15 models in OpenClaw and published two separate leaderboards: performance and cost-effectiveness.

The two boards look nothing alike. Top 3 performance: Claude Opus 4.6, GPT-5.4, Claude Sonnet 4.6. Top 3 cost-effectiveness: StepFun 3.5 Flash, Grok 4.1 Fast, MiniMax M2.7.

The most dramatic split: Claude Opus 4.6 is #1 on performance but #14 on cost-effectiveness. StepFun 3.5 Flash is #1 cost-effectiveness, #5 performance.

Other surprises: GLM-5 Turbo, Xiaomi MiMo v2 Pro, and MiniMax M2.7 all outrank Gemini 3.1 Pro on performance.

Rankings use relative ordering only (not raw scores) fed into a grouped Plackett-Luce model with bootstrap CIs. Same principle as Chatbot Arena — absolute scores are noisy, but "A beat B" is reliable. Full methodology: https://app.uniclaw.ai/arena/leaderboard/methodology?via=hn

I built this as part of OpenClaw Arena — submit any task, pick 2-5 models, a judge agent evaluates in a fresh VM. Public benchmarks are free.